The God Debate v2

[BaccaBoy1999]

How so?

Didn't you read I said I can't form words to explain.

 

[J]

TheParrot this thread will continue to stay open as it's just a civil discussion among forumers, these forums were made to express your opinions on here and so as long as the thread is flame-free, there's no point to lock it

 

[Twistology]

That is so ignorant I cannot even form words to explain how ignorant that is.

In what way is it ignorant? The world is full of pain and suffering and things that an 'all powerful, all loving' God wouldn't and shouldn't allow, and he puts it in a very well structured way. Please attempt to form some words to explain

 

[ChibiGoose]

In what way is it ignorant? The world is full of pain and suffering and things that an 'all powerful, all loving' God wouldn't and shouldn't allow, and he puts it in a very well structured way. Please attempt to form some words to explain

The reason is God gave us the ability to make our own decisions, that's why the world is the way it is. I don't fully understand it myself, and I might not ever, but I have to rely on faith. I don't expect you to understand though.

 

[Glade_OS]

*takes out more popcorn and starts eating* and back to our daily scheduled discussion :3

 

[boboy1999]

The reason is God gave us the ability to make our own decisions, that's why the world is the way it is. I don't fully understand it myself, and I might not ever, but I have to rely on faith. I don't expect you to understand though.

So insects that eat little children eyes out from the inside out is because we have the ability to make our own decision? I think God could have left that one out, don't you think? We have to rely on faith and believe that God still loves us even though he does insane unnecessary things to harm us? Hmmmm not buying it.

 

[ChibiGoose]

So insects that eat little children eyes out from the inside out is because we have the ability to make our own decision. I think God could have left that one out, don't you think? We have to rely on faith a believe that God still loves us even though he does insane unnecessary things to harm us? Hmmmm not buying it.

I don't see the point in a world where nothing bad happens, then there would literally be no point to anything. We wouldn't need science because our lives would be perfect, it would all be pointless. Once again though, I don't know fully, and never will.

 

[boboy1999]

I don't see the point in a world where nothing bad happens, then there would literally be no point to anything. We wouldn't need science because our lives would be perfect, it would all be pointless. Once again though, I don't know fully, and never will.

But God has the power to do ANYTHING he wants. Why not leave out unnecessary suffering that can't be prevented by prayer and medicine. Why would a good christian person who only does things in the name of God get cancer? What is the point of worshiping and loving him if he is going to allow bad things to happen anyway and only "stops" things he feels like stopping. If there was a God, honestly he doesn't deserve and kind of worship.

 

[ChibiGoose]

But God has the power to do ANYTHING he wants. Why not leave out unnecessary suffering that can't be prevented by prayer of medicine. Why would a good christian person who only does things in the name of God get cancer? What is the point of worshiping and loving him if he is going to allow bad things to happen anyway and only "stops" things he feels like stopping. If there was a God, honestly he doesn't deserve and kind of worship.

I don't know why he allows such terrible things happen to people, but that doesn't mean I don't love him. It'd be like me not loving my parents because they aren't always perfect. Later maybe I'll find out/understand why fully.

 

[boboy1999]

I don't know why he allows such terrible things happen to people, but that doesn't mean I don't love him. It'd be like me not loving my parents because they aren't always perfect.

"He is the Rock, his works are perfect, and all his ways are just. A faithful God who does no wrong, upright and just is he." Deuteronomy 32:4

"As for God, his way is perfect: The LORD's word is flawless; he shields all who take refuge in him." Psalm 18:30

"And Jesus said to him, "Why do you call Me good? No one is good except God alone."
Mark 10:18

But God is perfect and his works are flawless...
You love God no matter what he does? That makes no sense and that is a blind way of living. Your parents may not be perfect but I'm sure they wouldn't deliberately hurt you for no reason.

 

[ChibiGoose]

"He is the Rock, his works are perfect, and all his ways are just. A faithful God who does no wrong, upright and just is he." Deuteronomy 32:4

"As for God, his way is perfect: The LORD's word is flawless; he shields all who take refuge in him." Psalm 18:30

"And Jesus said to him, "Why do you call Me good? No one is good except God alone."
Mark 10:18

But God is perfect and his works are flawless...
You love God no matter what he does? That makes no sense and that is a blind way of living. Your parents may not be perfect but I'm sure they wouldn't deliberately hurt you for no reason.

No, I just don't see the world as bad as people make it out to be. I also said I do think there is a reason for the way the world is, but I just don't know it. It might not even be comprehendible by the human brain, I really don't know.

 

[Tahsin]

Right. I am not sure if anyone has said this and it might be a little long and maybe slightly too complex but anyways.

I believe that everything must have a starting point so for this universe to exist, someone or something must have created it and that something was the Big Bang of course. However, something else must have triggered the Big Bang and I believe that what triggered the Big Bang was God. However, saying that, some people can argue "who created God if everything must have a starting point or let's say, have a creator".

It was at that point that I came across a video explaining about a concept called "infinite regress" and basically, it is like, let's imagine that I am playing Call of Duty and I am about to shoot a guy, however, before shooting that guy, I must ask permission to my commander who then, in a hypothetical situation, has to ask permission to the person in charge above them about me shooting the guy and that person above them has to ask the commander above them also and this can go on to the infinite. Now, if everyone keeps on asking the person above them over and over again, I will practically never be able to actually shoot as the commanders would just be asking for permissions to the ones above them each time whether I can shoot or not. So, in this scenario, I am unable to actually shoot unless I get permission from above but if this request of permission goes through the infinite past, I will never get a definite person who can tell me "yes, you can shoot."

Now, that may sound stupid but it is useful because it can be applied to the universe. So, if I say, what or who created the universe, and then I ask who or what created the creator of the universe and then I ask who created this creator, this question would go for infinity without an end. However, if infinity has no end, we would essentially never get to a universe being created seeing as, if there are an infinite amount of creators, something would be created from the current universe too and this would go on forever. Just to paraphrase that again, for the creator who created this universe to have created this universe, he must have been dependant on the creator before him but if that creator is lost in the infinite past, we would never get to the creator that created this universe. Therefore, seeing as this universe exists, it proves that whoever created this universe (God) didn't have a creator as it had to have an ultimate source.

Just try and read this a few times and try to understand it. It is a little complex but hopefully you get the idea.