Community Discussion: Should Ex-Hackers be Considered for Mod?

[BaccaBoy1999]

I have a friend of mine that was banned for rei's mini-map. He was promoting the community by making a video of himself playing a game on mcsg. He loves the community so much, yet the only reason he cannot get past the application stage, is because of the blemish on his record.

Why would hackers want to be moderators in the 1st place?

#1 They regret their past decisions, and would want to serve the community in return.
#2 They do not care for the community, and would love to ban anyone that gets in their way.

I propose the 100 hackers rule:

If a user has been banned for a hack related reason that was not successfully disputed, then they need to catch 100 hackers with recorded evidence, and report abuse, marked with "100 hackers"

Once this service has been compleed, they may apply as any other user may apply, with a link to a direct message with a Sr. Mod saying "user has completed the 100 hackers service" or something similar.

This will show the devotion from the user to the server, and would allow the user to apply as any other user.

*typed all this on my phone*

 

[SniperSnakez]

I have a friend of mine that was banned for rei's mini-map. He was promoting the community by making a video of himself playing a game on mcsg. He loves the community so much, yet the only reason he cannot get past the application stage, is because of the blemish on his record.

Why would hackers want to be moderators in the 1st place?

#1 They regret their past decisions, and would want to serve the community in return.
#2 They do not care for the community, and would love to ban anyone that gets in their way.

I propose the 100 hackers rule:

If a user has been banned for a hack related reason that was not successfully disputed, then they need to catch 100 hackers with recorded evidence, and report abuse, marked with "100 hackers"

Once this service has been compleed, they may apply as any other user may apply, with a link to a direct message with a Sr. Mod saying "user has completed the 100 hackers service" or something similar.

This will show the devotion from the user to the server, and would allow the user to apply as any other user.

*typed all this on my phone*

100 hackers... damn that's a lot of hackers!

 

[Sixorr]

To be honest, I feel as if it has been at LEAST eight months since that ban, and they have had no other offenses, then they should be allowed to apply for mod.

 

[BaccaBoy1999]

100 hackers... damn that's a lot of hackers!

That is a big part of being a mod, so it would show us their devotion to mcsg.

 

[ChadTheDJ]

Queuing "LeafyGreenTea for Mod" posts. Anyways in all seriousness, interesting debate going on here! Getting a lot of interesting incite over this issue.

 

[Zeno]

Queuing "LeafyGreenTea for Mod" posts. Anyways in all seriousness, interesting debate going on here! Getting a lot of interesting incite over this issue.

#LEAFYGREENTEA4MOD2014!

 

[The_Man]

I believe at least 12 months since the last ban for previous hackers to be able to be eligible for mod.

 

[Kraken]

My two cents:
While I do believe that somebody who hacks does lack vital concern for the networks welfare, the fact and the matter is, people do change. They might have just been having a laugh, checking out what the hack does or whatever their reason may be, I don't believe somebody who used a hacked client should be forever banned from applying for moderator and here are my reasons why:

• Hacking is set aside from chat offenses (abuse mainly in this example) for a few reasons. For this though, somebody who abuses another player clearly has zero respect for other members, a vital role in a staff members job description. However, when somebody hacks, I believe it doesn't necessarily portray a bad attitude for a moderator position, as they aren't directly hurting other users in the same way abuse does. Hacking doesn't hurt the network in the same way abuse does. It just gives them an unfair advantage. Sure it angers everyone, it royally drives me up the wall when people hack, but comparatively, it doesn't hurt people in the same way abuse does. When they hack, all they're doing is making it easier to win.
• A clear metaphor for this, is that when somebody commits a crime out in the real world, it goes on their criminal record, however they aren't always banned from applying for jobs. It certainly makes it harder to apply for a job if there is even the hint of something on your criminal record, but you are always considered for the position, same as everyone else. Here, however, if you have served a full sentence for using a hacked/modified client, you are forever banned from even being considered for a moderator position. Of course, this is a game, why should we adopt all social norms? However it is food for thought.
• Back again to the fact that people do change. They do. somebody who simply didn't care about the community or repercussions of breaking the rules may make friends in the community, get involved in things and, as so many have, fall in love with the network. From then on they are enlightened, and vow to uphold every single rule and encourage others to do so. A prime quality for a moderator. They may wish so desperately to apply for moderator, but they can't, because long, long ago they used a hacked client. Yes, they previously lacked any care for what may come next if they hack, but that was then, this is now and they have changed. They've grown up and matured to the point where they have the qualities of a great moderator. In fact, it is not the number of mistakes one makes that decides if they are a good or bad moderator, it is ones ability or inability to learn from their mistakes that defines a good moderator. Somebody who has made mistakes in their past and learned from them has a lot more experience to speak from, than somebody who hasn't made any mistakes.

Now I'm not rallying behind any particular case, saying we should start allowing past hackers to apply for mod, far from it. However I believe that it is certainly worth exploring and discussing. There are plenty of people out there who would made great moderators, but their past mistakes have forever restricted their ability to apply. The question isn't Are there previous hackers out there who would make great moderators, we all know somebody who fits that category. I know many myself. The question is Is it worth the resources to find them and watch them carefully. I definitely think this is a path worth exploring or considering. Maybe a certain amount of time must elapse before they can apply? Maybe they must fill in a far more extensive application form, and a far more rigorous interview process, and be put on a trial period, along with a much higher standard for passing the application process. Many laugh at the idea of LeafyGreenTea applying for moderator. Well.... people change. I don't believe he installed hacks to maliciously take down the network. he was probably just after a bit of a laugh.

 

[Kraken]

Thank you for that c:

Aw thanks <3


Before I start, I just want to mention this: I am NOT saying that I hacked. I was simply banned, and the reason given was "Sprint Hacks". The evidence was deemed several times as sufficient to have the ban upheld. I deny any usage of hacks or unfair mods.
With that out of the way, allow me to give my own personal story and view on this subject.

Think back to mid to late March of 2013. I'm the co-leader (Maybe leader by that time) of what was one of the top US clans. I run across one of my oldest MCSG friends, Krafty, on Teweran Survival Games Two. We both make it to DeathMatch, and we face off. I kill him with difficulty, and the game ends, and we go our separate ways. That Friday night, I'm playing on Teweran Survival Games One, and I am fighting on ice, facing against some people who are calling me out, claiming that I have hacks. I end the game. I don't remember whether or not I win, but when I try to log back into MCSG, I see something unusual: I'm banned for 7 days. The reason? Sprint Hacks.
I immediately jump to the conclusion that the people calling me out for hacks were the ones that got banned, so I make a Ban Appeal, pleading my case, insisting that I'm just good at Ice-Fights. A day or two passes, and I receive a reply. My ban has been upheld, and GibboAssassin says, "There's no ice in the evidence". I go, "wat' and when I see the evidence, I notice that it was from when I fought Krafty (Then known as CraftyKratonite) and is in fact on sand, ironically. I later found out that it was Krafty's friend, ARB1T3R who recorded the evidence, and Krafty claims that he did not think I was hacking, and would talk to Arby. (I have nothing against him, if a staff member wants they can censor his name, as it doesn't affect this story.)
Time passes, and eventually I come to terms that my chances of obtaining Moderator are non-existant. I still did, and still do, wish to obtain the rank, but I suppose I've come to accept that it's simply not going to happen. I have appealed the ban several times, and it has been upheld. I have applied for Moderator, as well, on a whim, and that has turned sour as well. I also privately messaged a few Senior Mods who were active on the Forums, in the hope that they could perhaps find a way for me to have a ban exception to no avail.

As the glamorous (lol) JennoKoala stated in his post above, we collaborated on a PSA about lag issues. I did a fairly decent portion of the work, and I was approached by Col_StaR who thanked me for my efforts and offered me an opportunity: I had a chance to have my ban overlooked. I eagerly replied, and explained how I had PMed the Senior Mods and whatnot, and waited for a reply, which did indeed come, but after quite a while, and with bad news. I had been unfortunately reported as involved with a group trying to have a certain high-ranking staff member demoted using absurd methods. The offer was retracted, and any hopes I had of achieving Moderator were exiled to the deepest regions of the Nether.

To this day, I continue to inhabit the MCSG Forums, posting and helping, informing and debating. But I don't do it in the hopes of achieving Moderator, now I simply do it because I like to, and I get bored if I don't.



Okay my fingers hurt... onto the second part of this post ;_;


Do I think ex-hackers should be considered for Mod?
To condense my thoughts into a single word - Yes.
However, do I believe ex-hackers should be given an equal chance for Mod? Sorry all you recently banned hackers, but no.

This is an example of what I believe is a good example of a qualified ex-hacker:

• Lots of experience in-game, with not only MCSG but Minecraft in general.
• Knowledge of different types of hacks -what they look like, how they change the game, how to spot them.
• Decently well-respected around the community. Maybe not everyone's favorite bovine, but someone who can be trusted to have reliable information.
• A strong work-ethic. Willing to help, even if it means letting go of personal spa-time and beauty sleep.
• A lot of time since they last hacked (or in my case, were accused of hacks) since MCG isn't exactly going to hire someone who got banned a few weeks ago.

It makes sense that they would be a pretty good candidate, right? Heck, I've heard MCSG Mods state that they hack on other servers before becoming Staff on MCSG. It's not a huge difference, except for the fact that the server they hack on isn't the one they're a staff member on.




aaaaaaaaand my mom just came home so I have to stop typing now.
This is just my $00.02 (Or maybe $30, small difference )
But hey, if I can change even a single person's view on this subject, then my job here is done.

As I said in my post, he speaks from experience, and in my opinion, has a lot more sense behind his words.

 

[Thapple_]

 

[Kraken]

Simplest answer on this thread yet

 

[Thapple_]

Simplest answer on this thread yet

But really, hackers shouldn't be able to apply for moderator. I just feel it's too late to change this rule. Like, we've gone to far and we can't just be all wibbly wobbly with the qualifications for staff positions.